Will they never learn.

Posted: Fri Feb 10, 2012 12:01 am Post subject: Will they never learn.

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Posted: Fri Feb 10, 2012 1:06 pm Post subject: Re: Will they never learn.

Do you think the banker learn?
Do you think Israel has learnt anything?
Why do we expect criminals to learn????? Drug dealers carry on dealing in drugs in prison and prostitutes carry on being on the game inside prison
The trouble with the media is that they pick and chose.

By the way i am glad they arrested such vile people, they're criminals who deserve prison but we should focus more at the source of evil rather than trying to fix the cracks. Saudi Arabia and part of Libya did a good job at converting these criminals to law abiding citizens . many became better now and have denounce terrorism. The question is can the real terrorists give up???? by real terrorists i am speaking of those who drop bombs on innocents babies and women meaning they have already committed evil and walk free and even get great reception as heroes

Posted: Fri Feb 10, 2012 8:59 pm Post subject: Re: Will they never learn.

I love it when you turn a thread around... Wink

The topic up for discussion was the British Muslims (misguided tho they be) being jailed for planning acts of terrorism within the UK. This is not a war...it is not an exercise in fiscal studies...I:e banking.. Or even a question on drugs, prostitution or crimes of that type.

But will these disenfranchised young men never learn that terrorism..as in sneakily planning to plant bombs to blow up passers by in the mistaken belief it will somehow further their cause...which is... Confused

well you tell me. Will never win them any ground. They will now serve a prison term a waste of a life, whilst the real culprits those that encourage such acts are still living among us ready to persuade other gullible young men into doing something they are too cowardly to do themselves.

Any efforts by anyone to dissuade such behaviour should be welcomed .... Wherever it comes from.

Posted: Sat Feb 11, 2012 1:05 am Post subject: Re: Will they never learn.

I do not go around the bush. i am very precise in my thinking.

the source of evil is what we need to eraze not parliament fixings.
let's look at one example
Today a Kosovan soldier was sentenced for killing 2 US soldiers why? he said because he saw a video of another US soldiers raping a Muslim woman.
Do you believe he was wrong or right? personally i believe he was wrong and any civilian death is a form of terrorism but the source of evil remains even when we arrest him hence problem temporary fixed but not resolved because as soon as another US soldier gets hold of Alcohol after being kept in no man's land for many years the moment he sees a woman and with all his anger inside him he would rape another woman and it happened again and again because the sodiers sent there are no better then devils, loss souls, with their brain washed no different from so called terrorists.

When the Uk learns they 'll stop supporting terrorists and would ban arms that kill innocents and stop training people like Qadafi clans while LiByan were being killed etc............andwhile their PR come on Skynews feeding lies to the mass stupid retards who read the sun newspapers and do not even know goes on abroad........ then no one would try to get revenge.
The question we should be asking is why no one has ever targetted Finland or even south africa.....? why always the US and europe? the answer????? because these people are terrorists who always side with the antichrist and bow to the devil.

The above does not mean that i am in agrement with these people or against but I am simply trying to remind you that a one's terrorist in Isreal or the Uk is another's freedom fighter in Ireland or Palestine.

Posted: Sat Feb 11, 2012 12:01 pm Post subject: Re: Will they never learn.

Here we go again..evil...alcohol...antichrist...I am starting to think you actually believe it. Shocked

Lets think outside the box for a sec...look at cause and effect. Alcohol is not the evil, it does not turn people bad just by the drinking of it. If that were so it would be chaos...I'm not saying it does not cause problems in society it does, mainly the people affected by it in this way usually have other issues. Alcohol becomes their excuse for bad behaviour, but they have to be capable of that bad behaviour in the first instance.

In the theatre of war people do not behave as they normally would, because war is not a natural place to be in..but it has to be said for many people it seems that way Crying or Very sad

It gives some people an excuse to behave badly. Example here...in a Nazi death camp a catholic woman stands before the Doctor with her two children at the selection. The Doctor, who for reasons unknown gives her a choice. She can choose one child to live the other will go to the gas. How can a mother choose that? but she knows if she does not then both children will go to the gas. Who is evil? the woman who knowingly sends her child to its death or the Nazi who gave her that impossible choice. This Doctor under normal circumstances would likely never think of such an evil thing...but the theater of war gives him that excuse for him to indulge if you will his darker side.

God created the world and all in it. Ok..you choose to believe that everything happens by his will..even that you should be tempted to sin. How can this be possible? we are all the same within each of us the exists the capability for good and bad, we know the difference. If God indeed watches our every progress I wonder why we have not all been wiped out by now, so persistant are we in getting it wrong and failing to learn the simplest of lessons, we forever edge towards self distruction or killing each other. Crying or Very sad

From an early age we learn from our families and peers what is morally good and acceptable and what is not. We all have this choice it never leaves us. Our dark side is always there...which you may choose to think of as an outside force..like Satan. But it's circumstances that gives this dark side power of us, and they are of our own making.

God knows we are weak...the reason he gave us the gift of Christ, was to show us the way to enlightenment. A very simple message but supprisingly difficult for people to grasp let alone put into practice.That is to forgive your enemies and have love in your heart. Imagine if everyone chose to forgive their enemy...no reason for wars. If you let love triumph over hate in your heart there would be no need for greed, envy or intollerence. Bliss indeed..we would be all equal in our eyes as we are in the eyes of God.

Soldier...Terrorist...Freedom fighter it makes no difference. They have the same affect, causing deaths sometimes innocent sometimes not. But are we right to judge who is wrong or who is right? who's cause is right and whose is not? makes no difference because both sides in any conflict believe they are in the right and so it will always be a stalemate. People will continue to die for a cause, and war will always be a big business.

Posted: Sat Feb 11, 2012 12:11 pm Post subject: Re: Will they never learn.

Just to add re the Sun newspaper...I agree. Do people still "read" it.... Shocked

Also to refer what you said in your post regards the rape...It really should be witnesses the rape of a woman. Weather she was a Muslim woman, Christian woman, or an Athiest woman. The fact that she was raped at all was an bad enough. Mad

Her religion is immaterial.

Posted: Sat Feb 11, 2012 9:34 pm Post subject: Re: Will they never learn.

Arwen
please forgive my erors and God knows best and no offence intended.
I always said that you have failed to understand the concept of God and that is not your fault because you see God as Christian god like Xman who transforms from one bit to another(and no disrespect to you honesttly ) where as Muslims see God as invisible never changes and nothing is like him he has no son or daughter and is not inside our dominion. he is outside it just like a fish tank, all fish can see each others but God can turn off the heat ,the water and put in food etc.. and the fish still have no idea so God here is in full control but still invisible to the fish and one day can totally destroy the whole tank and remains God. God does not need to change form in order to make us understand that would make him weak god and he is Not weak he is the Almighty God. The moment you understand who God is then you would automatically be a muslim even if you refuse to believe in his prophet.

you said

God created the world and all in it. Ok..you choose to believe that everything happens by his will..even that you should be tempted to sin. How can this be possible?
Please allow me to explain

God 50.000 years before Adam was created in physical body decided that he would create human beings in his master plan he decided to created MR X
So Mr X was given 1 million pound in wealth to use in all his life
100 years in life
and the freedom to do what he wishes as long as his actions do not interfere with someone else actions
he sent 8 angels with him to look after him and also sent him a devil to be with him all his life
you Mrs A could go and drop 1 million tons of bombs near mr X and Mr X still remains alife and you wonder why? because as per God's plan Mr X must live 100 years
When Mr X is always with God, God stops devils from harming him and send angels to be near him and when angels are near him he is safe........... Mr x Feels that God loves him
When Mr X ignore God and does what God dislike MRx would still recieve his 1million pound and still live a great life and God does not stop him but God would call the angels back and when angels are back devils join Mr X /////////////hence sins and more sins
Over all Mr X still enjoys what he likes but whatever good he does is recorded as single sins and whatever good deeds he does are recorded in multiple numbers depending on how he pleased God's creation .men animals plants etc...
now this is 50.000 years before Adam was created. because God knows what shall happens to Mr X therefore God has full knowledge of his life everything we are doing have already passed in the master plan and that is why God knows all events before happening. we are simply living the life God promissed us .read quran more

I hope that explained the wisdom of God
everything we do has a condition attached to it -----------“Thus saith the LORD, Set thine house in order; for thou shalt die, and not live.” Here we have the appointed time for Hezekiah to die. However, in this case Hezekiah cries out to the LORD, and God intervenes by adding fifteen years unto his life (2 Kings 20:6). --------
but the full will is God's will except our sins God does not help us in making sins he can stop anyone who may cause total madness from being committed .
you said
God knows we are weak...the reason he gave us the gift of Christ, was to show us the way to enlightenment

exactly he did but only to the people of Israel to teach them love and how to live a good life but he never sent a prophet in order for men to ignore God and worship a human being. similary he sent Mohammed saws as mercy to mankind and a guidance to the truth but the truth can only be found if one really wishes to find it . remember???????? when you look for God God send angels to you and devils leave you alone and therefore you would see sense otherwise
-----------------DEAF DUMB BLIND-------------------
Plus Jesus (as) never claimed to be God or son of god nor did he said that eh would be crusified he merely said that he would go back to God which we Muslims believe. plus he can not die twice because he said that men die once and once only. that is why we say he shall return and then die a normal death
----------------Heb 9:27, “it is appointed unto to man ONCE to die and after this the judgment.”------------
the rest of your post is correct
by standard men love Good even in gangs they prefer to have good and respect .... we call this standard Fitra (installed default basic morality) when ever you fall back you would want to restore to default

Posted: Sat Feb 11, 2012 11:21 pm Post subject: Re: Will they never learn.

I'm struggling to grasp your post...or that you believe any of it. How can you believe that the Christians view God as some kind of super being...or indeed mankind just appeared on earth a mere 50,000 years ago...are you serious? Confused

I'm almost speechless...at a loss for words..how to explain to you but then you will not want to understand anyway so what's the point...

The reason Christ never claimed to be God or expected to be worshipped as such...was the simple fact he was not God, but of God....there is a difference. He referred to God as his father as we all refer to God in our prayers. His life and his death was preordained and the reason clear to him, it's also clear to those who choose to follow his direction. God...Christ and the Holy Spirit are one and the same. God as supreme power (not a superman figure) is omnipresent and capable of anything and it's not you or I to question....but the books of men Bible, Quran etc are something else..written by men they can only ever be man's interpretation of Gods will.

You can read all the religious books in all the world but you will not find God, you will not find God in the rules and regulations of the religion you prescribe to, the only place you will find God is in your heart and in your understanding. I know in my heart and I understand what is required of me as part of this human race. It saddens me at tiimes that you cannot see the truth through my eyes, because I will never make you understand and really it's not my place. Everyone has to find their own truth and their own peace. I have mine and it would seem you have yours so be it. Happy days.

Peace.

Posted: Sun Feb 12, 2012 12:55 pm Post subject: Re: Will they never learn.

If you fail to understand my post then that is my fault for not explaining it properly

the idea is
God is our Lord
He created us as souls before Adam was created and told us that we will be put in bodies and sent on earth to be tested. part of the test is that each of us has a devil with in him or her devil can be of two types physical ie created from smokless fire and the wickedness in us ie our darkside.
Since our lives have already been known by God before we were even created in bodies, whatever we do is already recorded therefore when God says that he would send someone to hell is because if you were to read the book of that person you would find that at the end of his life he would be a total loss .and similary when a wicked man lives a terrible life but still end up in heaven is because if you were to read his book you would find that at the end of his life he repented and made ammends so he would be a winner.
to remind us of God . God send us prophets who are men who eat drink ..... human being not angels not part of God not angels /.///// to make them do their mission peoperly they get miracles with them for an appointed time only. some gets to speak to God like Moses (pbuh) some get to be lifed to heaven like Enooch(Idris) and others would go to God and will return to finish their mission which was never accomplished like Jesus (pbuh). others get killed for a reason so that we can tell the difference between good and bad.......... everything happens for a reason good or bad.
It is very simply .
You get to be judged if you get the message and if not you are free from blame

when you get the message and refuse to follow you are called Kafeer a disbeliever
If you are a Muslim then you have believed in all previous prophets 124.000 of them all equal in our sights but with different status in God's sight.
Right now you are a disbeliever because you claim to disbelieve in the prophet who asked you to not associate partners to God like the Catholics who call Marriam(the virgin) the mother of Jesus (pbh them) mother of god and you who call jesus part of God. you can say what you like but all churches around the whole call jesus son of god or god.
that is why when he returns he shall say to them -----go away from me wicked people i do not know you and they shall say but we called you lord lord.......................)
and the holly ghost to us is no more then Prophet Gabiel(pbuh) who was present before all of us .and whn jesus the prophet of children of Israel was born he was sent to strenghend him ie be with him all the time and you have angels with you all the time the devils leave you alone and you would feel strong in spirit
and yes you have your ways and i have mine and mine is to worship the lord alone and associated none to him the Lord who created everything including jesus and Mohammed (pbuthem)

Posted: Sun Feb 12, 2012 11:05 pm Post subject: Re: Will they never learn.

There you go I knew you would not understand...no matter. You can only refer to me in your terms as an unbeliever...that is what your faith of Islam tells you to do. I of course know differently, and it is your soul at risk not mine. Maybe you are mixing up catholic belief with Christian ? Similar in many ways but different in some. It's difficult to explain the concept of the Trinity to one who's heart and mind is closed against it, so I won't even bother.

You claim Christs mission was never accomplished...in this you are wrong.

Because it's a very long mission and none can know the duration. The death and /resurrection was just part of the mission as a whole. Creation - fall of man - Jesus death for sin - Church age to spread the gospel - second coming for him to establish an eternal kingdom which will be on this earth for 1000 years before the earth is destroyed and a new one is created. Whether you believe in it or not this is the explanation.

So it matters not a jot if churches proclaim the worship of Christ or God as they are one and the same. But the answers to all these questions are easily found and explained by better qualified than me. But it doesn't really matter because you have already decided your truth. Laughing

Posted: Mon Feb 13, 2012 12:44 am Post subject: Re: Will they never learn.

Arwen

I know Chistianity far better than what you think.

It does not change the facts that the trinity is not even mentioned in the bible and only mentioned in the Quran why? because it was created by Men and not Christ like it or hate it. hence why those who woke up realised it was fake and then being still locked chosen to go for part of GOD concept. trinity is followed by over 2/3 of Christians

325 A.D. First General Council at Nicea, declared that the Son was from the beginning of the same nature as the Father.
381 A.D. Second General Council at Constantinople, declared that the Holy Spirit was to be worshipped with the Father and the Son.
431 A.D. Third General Council at Ephesus, decreed that Jesus had two natures, a human and a divine; also that Mary was the "mother of God", in opposition to those who maintained that she was the "mother of Christ".
451 A.D.Fifth General Council at Chalcedon, decreed that the two natures in Christ constituted only one Person and one will.

The truth is go anywhere around you and ask ANYONE WHO JESUS is ?? 99% would say either

1- son of God
2- God

------
Others were convinced that Jesus was God:
Paul: "Christ is the visible image of the invisible God."1
John: "He existed in the beginning with God."2
Peter: "you must worship Christ as Lord of your life."3
---------

but shame on those who associate partners with God Almighty OPEN YOUR EYES it is clear that Jesus as is a prophet of God and God is one
----------------
the Unity of God. 'Hear, O Israel: The Lord our God, the Lord is One.
--------------------
"The Son can do nothing of himself, but what he seeth the Father do . . ." (John 5:19).
"My teaching is not mine, but his that sent me" (7:16).
"The Father is greater than I . . ." (14:28).
"Why callest thou me good? There is none good but one, that is God" (Mark 10:18).------------
never been crucified but rather raised to God
--------
"Go unto my brethren and say unto them, I ascend unto my Father and your Father, and to my God and your God" (John 20:19).
-------

Posted: Mon Feb 13, 2012 12:51 am Post subject: Re: Will they never learn.

And the reason why people never learn??? because they are diluted. That ends my talk

Posted: Mon Feb 13, 2012 1:22 am Post subject: Re: Will they never learn.

But you don't know TT...you are just reading the words and seeing what you want to see. Knowing is more than that.

Reason people never learn is they never see things as they are but how they perceive them to be....That ends my talk..

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......................................................You know me...always have to have the last word. Wink

Posted: Mon Feb 13, 2012 3:28 pm Post subject: Re: Will they never learn.

JOIN THE CLUB

Ask yourself why would Mohammed saws an Arab and Arabs never liked their cousins the Jews since Abraham's time would stand up and call all Arabs and say to Arabs that :

Mariam the jewish woman is the best women ever created and is the mother of all believers, why not say my mother ...? why would he also say Yassoh the Jew is an almighty Prophet of God and he shall return to break the Cross(fake){even if i were to believe that crusifixation happened the Jews never crucified anyone using a cross but simply hunger the person on a tree ) and kill the pig which is a symbol of christianity

Posted: Mon Feb 13, 2012 6:28 pm Post subject: Re: Will they never learn.

Really TT can you only ever think literally...cross ....tree...piece of wood...it's figurative. Why would you believe in the accounts of Christs death? I would not expect you to...it carries no importance for you. But you should respect that for a Christian it is important as is the reason why it came about. You can offer no proof that your version of events is actual fact....so forgive me if I choose to take your words with a large pinch of salt...figuratively speaking...that is.. Laughing

BTW... It was not the Jews who crucified Christ ...but the Romans...which you know very well and I suspect you are just trying to wind me up Wink

the Jews brought the case against him but the sentence was down to the Romans ...who were I believe top dogs at the time. I fail to see what the pig has to do with Christianity...maybe you can enlighten me on that one. Other than the old testament forbids the eating of pork.